I found this track to be a straightforward and enjoyable country twanger which was well performed and nicely recorded. The unusual instrumentation of a concert harp certainly is unique and was a fun addition. I did not have much problem with bleed although I did take my time to cross-fade out most of it between phrases in the vocal tracks.
My concentration was mostly on the vocal and making sure Mikaela's voice was solid, smooth and understandable.
There's just a bit of automation, mostly on the vocal master buss.
I have offered up both an unfaded and faded version of this mix (identical but for the fade), just to see if it flies.
Comments appreciated.
Enjoy.
mITc
Home in the Country - Mix 4w
As much as I hate to admit it, Monk is right. My first mix is a bit hard to listen to for all the reasons mentioned in the thread. While I am uncomfortable with the man's approach, he is hardly ever wrong.
Mix 4a is redone with a more focused vocals while allowing the lead to fall back into the smoother ensemble.
Good balanced mix. Like it, too.
Hi, good balance! Overall It feels like there is a hole in de mids/ low mids - I think its the vocals?
Cheers!
I would appreciate some help with this please dude.
Just focusing on the lead, I’m picking up a spatial problem where she appears to move L/R. I’m wondering if you have some M/S thing going on in the master buss which is producing this effect – unintentional consequences? Whatever, I’d like to understand the cause which lies behind what I’m hearing….
Thanks in advance
(21-09-2023, 01:09 PM)Monk Wrote: [ -> ]I would appreciate some help with this please dude.
Just focusing on the lead, I’m picking up a spatial problem where she appears to move L/R. I’m wondering if you have some M/S thing going on in the master buss which is producing this effect – unintentional consequences? Whatever, I’d like to understand the cause which lies behind what I’m hearing….
Thanks in advance
Psycho-acoustic tricks which I will not reveal. These were specifically designed to tweak your curiosity.
Not really...
There is an imager used on her vocal sub to slightly widen her image in front of the ensemble and a widener in the mastering chain.
Do you want to guess which one?
Hmmmmmmm. I’m not sure why you didn’t merely drop an M/S eq on her rather than deploy the Shenanigan.dll. At least it won’t make the voice unstable in the stereo domain. Posts above mentioned “balanced”, but I have no idea what they were listening to.
I personally find your mixmaster too wide. It’s a minimalist arrangement, and mono sources; too much separation adds excessive focus, eg rhythm gtr. Its role is surely not worthy of so much attention which you’re drawing to it. Is it perhaps your instrument of choice? It also puts big empty spaces between the performers (wide speaker placement really flags this up cf nearfields). In a wide arrangement, you are helping to aggravate the spectral disparity between the channels, which increases listener fatigue.
Mikaela has long arms in your mix (and most other threads), no?
(24-09-2023, 11:53 AM)Monk Wrote: [ -> ]Hmmmmmmm. I’m not sure why you didn’t merely drop an M/S eq on her rather than deploy the Shenanigan.dll. At least it won’t make the voice unstable in the stereo domain. Posts above mentioned “balanced”, but I have no idea what they were listening to.
I personally find your mixmaster too wide. It’s a minimalist arrangement, and mono sources; too much separation adds excessive focus, eg rhythm gtr. Its role is surely not worthy of so much attention which you’re drawing to it. Is it perhaps your instrument of choice? It also puts big empty spaces between the performers (wide speaker placement really flags this up cf nearfields). In a wide arrangement, you are helping to aggravate the spectral disparity between the channels, which increases listener fatigue.
Mikaela has long arms in your mix (and most other threads), no?
Dude,
If you don't like my approach to the mix, just say so. Like, "I find your mix fatiguing".
As for my M/S eq, I have a very nice one on each of my busses which I use when I feel it is the best solution for clarity and placement. My decision, my mix.
Please define what you mean by the instability of the voice in the stereo domain. That seems nebulous at best and vague at worst. What instability are you hearing which I am not?
As for the widening, it is done mostly by the placement of the mono sources in the stereo field. Because of the paucity of content the clarity of each element was a desired solution musically and arrangement-wise for me. Her voice was widened by only the slightest amount against the ensemble to have it fill most of the space in the middle. Again, any artificial widening was very minimal. I don;t typically like the sound of a over-wide stereo field either and nothing is poking out of the sides here.
The feedback isn’t only about you. It’s for the educational benefit of the community as a whole, of which we participants contribute willingly to this fundamental cause. I am making a contribution herewith, and others can benefit (or not, as the case often is). If I merely said your mix was fatiguing, you wouldn’t know the cause (otherwise it wouldn’t have been posted with the issues). Similarly, anyone reading wouldn’t have a clue because the causes underlying fatigue are many and varied, some not so obvious. As a self proclaimed audio engineer, I’d expect you to understand this.
There are issues in your mix. The voice moving about in the stereo domain is a major one, however a critique is what it is, and there’s plenty to critique because of the issues in the arrangement and how this impinges on any mix vision, not least yours. It’s a difficult song to mix and this shouldn’t be under estimated which appears to have been the case according to your OP. Some of these problems are foisted upon us by telefunken eg printed automation, which I will say again, adds to the complexities and compromises.
The example I gave regarding the problem with the lead vocal is very real and needs to be understood. It’s underlying problem offers a valuable learning opportunity for everyone here, including myself. I suspect there to be a phase issue somewhere which M/S processing is possibly aggravating in this instance? M/S hates phase. Whatever, your treatment and parameter selection is causing it somehow and it would be helpful to everyone here, especially you, if you identified the cause rather than being defensive of a faulty mixmaster. You have not done so yet despite my request and a clear description regarding the nature of the outcome!
Your mixmaster is fatiguing. Fatigue is not a matter of taste or personal preference. Many are fatiguing. My rough draft is. My new mix isn’t because I spent an inordinate amount of time working out how best to overcome the issues, along with a few other, errr, challenges. You would be wise to do the same?
Yes, it is indeed “YOUR” mix. Now you have an opportunity to fix some things (or try to fix!) should you wish, including the illusion of Mikaela’s ridiculously long arms.
(29-09-2023, 09:16 AM)Monk Wrote: [ -> ]The feedback isn’t only about you. It’s for the educational benefit of the community as a whole, of which we participants contribute willingly to this fundamental cause. I am making a contribution herewith, and others can benefit (or not, as the case often is). If I merely said your mix was fatiguing, you wouldn’t know the cause (otherwise it wouldn’t have been posted with the issues). Similarly, anyone reading wouldn’t have a clue because the causes underlying fatigue are many and varied, some not so obvious. As a self proclaimed audio engineer, I’d expect you to understand this.
There are issues in your mix. The voice moving about in the stereo domain is a major one, however a critique is what it is, and there’s plenty to critique because of the issues in the arrangement and how this impinges on any mix vision, not least yours. It’s a difficult song to mix and this shouldn’t be under estimated which appears to have been the case according to your OP. Some of these problems are foisted upon us by telefunken eg printed automation, which I will say again, adds to the complexities and compromises.
The example I gave regarding the problem with the lead vocal is very real and needs to be understood. It’s underlying problem offers a valuable learning opportunity for everyone here, including myself. I suspect there to be a phase issue somewhere which M/S processing is possibly aggravating in this instance? M/S hates phase. Whatever, your treatment and parameter selection is causing it somehow and it would be helpful to everyone here, especially you, if you identified the cause rather than being defensive of a faulty mixmaster. You have not done so yet despite my request and a clear description regarding the nature of the outcome!
Your mixmaster is fatiguing. Fatigue is not a matter of taste or personal preference. Many are fatiguing. My rough draft is. My new mix isn’t because I spent an inordinate amount of time working out how best to overcome the issues, along with a few other, errr, challenges. You would be wise to do the same?
Yes, it is indeed “YOUR” mix. Now you have an opportunity to fix some things (or try to fix!) should you wish, including the illusion of Mikaela’s ridiculously long arms.
I do not understand your objection to such a minor image issue, or that it exists at all. I was always taught that movement was good. Why is it bad in this instance?
Everyone is allowed to respectfully express their personal opinion of a mix. I feel we can all critique, agree and disagree with respect for each other too.
Cheers!
I note the above post has since been edited, much appreciated.