Preach right here - Marco's mix

[Andreas Tyranopoulos]

Well done Marco! Version D sounds just fine! 1 or 2 db higher the snare sample, or just cut some low mids (about 2 db on 100Hz?) on the other snare track and it will be perfect to my opinion!

[marco]

Thank you very much for your patient help Andreas!
Followed your suggestion again. Chose to try the low mid cut on snare, 97Hz 3dB. Yes, much better!
Then:
- made some correction on buss faders (in the range of barely-nothing to 0.7dB).
- wasn't happy with vocals at the end of the song, added an invasive delay there. Not sure of it, but gives fullness.
- last thing, realized i was hitting the limiter harder than i wanted (so on previous mixes too), and reduced 1.5dB of gain by more use of masterbus compressor (and no makeup). Result is less loud, but i think punchier. Does it sound too compressed now?

[marco]

Just some masterbus tweaks:

- quieter intro and first verse
- cut a bit of 30Hz
- attack/release on compressor
- turned off stereo plug

[marco]

Felt there was a little too much presence frequencies in the mix, and made a try turning high shelf boost off on drums bus (as it was initially there only in the attempt of getting more air, yeah that too...).
More room for vocals high frequencies now, darker drums (i like darkness on drums, but i think i should correct that).

Of course I'd like to know which version you prefer!

[marco]

I'm done, last mix posted, i promise! Hope i won't spam so much in future.
Chose the last version with more snare sample and a bit less of that vox delay at end of song.
Still not perfect, and opinions are always welcome, but that's it - definitely time to move next! -

Must say that i finally feel comfortable with it, thank you very much Andreas for having guided me step by step through this mix.
Got aware of lots of things, naming you in file's title isn't enough for the role you had in this mixing experience.

Marco

[Andreas Tyranopoulos]

I am amazed Marco with your patience and your work on that song! I can hear very clearly the big improvement! I have to say that I feel very shy and pleased that you speak for me like this and especially that you include my name in your song's title. I am very happy that you believe that I helped you but the achievement is yours!! The final version is your best! Nice balance and no annoying sound! Bravo!!

[sardhouse]

Mate, the drum isn't working... you killed it with too much compression/limiting on the snare. turn off the compression and let the transient breath. you'll see a great improvement. try also to lower the other instruments 'cause you are about to turn off limiting (if the rest of the multitrack sounds more louder than the drum just match the overall level and then restart to mix).
so, drum with much more dynamic, try to mix it well and listen carefully, then add the voice and the bass. when this configuration works you have to add the other instruments/ background vox etc
if i can, tomorrow i'm going to upload my mix, actually i spent 6 hours and my mix it is almost finished, so you can listen what i mean.
don't feel depressed, mixing music is very difficult, be patient.
cheers

[marco]

Should hear it back with fresh ears, but i think i will agree with you on snare's dynamics as it was one of the things i was in doubt for. Touching that would change the overall mix so much i'm aware it means starting it back again, so didn't touch it at all. I don't think the issue is the final limiter (yes 3-4dB of gain reduction it is much, but just working on few sporadic peaks), more probably snare's compressor or too much parallel drum compression.
Is that all you didn't like? Should have no reason to feel depressed then! But i think you didn't like other things too, if that's the case tell me what it is (i won't pull myself down for that, i'm adult!), won't open this mix back, but your suggestions could be useful for next mixes.
Yes, mixing music is very difficult, agree.

[sardhouse]

Hi Marco,
now i'll try to explain better the issue this is not matter of my taste mate... your snare is heavily squashed, and i can hear the lead vocal really compressed. you can't sell music in this way. mate, just to be clear, i did the same mistakes years ago... (i started producing my own music/mixing in 1997). i like compression, limiting and every useful tool, in fact i use every "weapon" in my pocket in order to create a better mix, but when i started i had to learn how to use all this stuff (or when don't use it). i'm not saying that i'm the best... absolutely i'm not, but after 17 years i learned something and i can hear differently now, so i want to help you suggesting useful ideas

remember, use a low volume during mixing (even if it's techno music lol) and don't touch the volume for any reason. you'll see an improvement in your sensibility during listening. don't use tools just because you have it, learn how and when use your tools

ps: this evening i'm going to upload my track, i spent almost 10 hours (in three different days 'cause i'm producing my own music), so, my mix is ready but i'll check it a last time with fresh ears after lunch so you'll be able to listen to what i wrote.

[marco]

Heard it back and yes, snare way too compressed, maybe master too. Also vocals could sound better with dynamics maybe, but i remember that less made me hear it moving forward and back too much. Maybe should've worked on time constants there.
Usually when i got compression issues is on the other side, my teacher always told me i should not fear to go to compression because my mixes sounded too live-sounding (as that was my reference, came from years of live playing with bands so i was used to not compressed music).
In this case defintely did too much instead, I'm happy someone warned me about that. Think i'm allright with theory and workflow things, and just use tools if my ears tell me to correct something, but have to improve practice for sure, i'm experimenting with these mixes to find the right compromises so help is welcome. Did you find anything you liked (or not as bad as the rest) in my mix?

One thing I learned that i want to share with you is there isn't a single right way to do things (mixes in particular). Mixes are the result of the interaction between you and the tracks, of your vision of the song, so things like objectiveness or unbreakable general rules are self illusions, there are just things that work for you, for your way to go and your aims (and tastes). Looking things from this point of view you can explain why some "weird-sounding" records sold a lot. Think of what people said when the first grunge records went out, or even one famous metal band - you know that if you hate loudness war - sold music with very few dBs of dynamic range through the entire album. Not that i like that, but someone did it and still sold a lot so you never can tell, it always remains a matter of points of view.

Thanks for commenting, i will take in mind your good observations in my future mixes!