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Arise - Run run run_Mix
#1
Hi guys, this my first mix on this genre, any suggestions-comments will be welcome!
It's been a fast mix, didn't do automations or anything to create more movement and keep listener's attention, so you may find it a bit static. If I'll have more time I'll try to do something about it, as your indications as well!
Please tell me what you think of it, I'm trying to improve my mixes...

Marco


.mp3    Arise - Run run run_Master mp3.mp3 --  (Download: 7.81 MB)


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#2
No feedback yet?
C'mon guys, this is a very cool site, let's make it work as it is intended.
Sharing opinions is good for the site and good for the people
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#3
Pretty good mix.

Organ coud have more definition and/or maybe less low mids.

Just as you said, the song arrangement is already too static, without automation its gets boring pretty fast.

Best way to get feedback is commenting on a few others mixes before uploading your mix. You have more mixes uploaded than reviews.
Please comment on others mixes, this site is all about feedback.
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#4
Thanx for this feedback too!
I'll try to subtract some low mids from organ, think you're right, it could sound better. Automation would take more time. As I wrote I'm complete newbie in reggae mixes, felt the instinct to go to automation but had no time and wondered if it was so necessary within this genre. From what you wrote i think it is.
About the ways to get feedback: I never listen to others mixes before finishing mine, just because want to see where i get without any reference at all, but usually comment others mixes after i finished mine. Not always, as you said, posted 4 mixes and commented just 3. If that's under users average just tell me and I will not invite people to comment anymore! (don't want to appear hypocrite, as I'm not)
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#5
Didnt wanted to sound harsh.

Just saying because lots of people just upload mixes and never review others mixes. Not judging those who do that but feels unpolite when those people demand for a review. Not saying it was your case.

You dont have to listen to the songs before mixing yours. I usually review at least 3 mixes right after i upload mine.

Pd: Reggae could have lots of automation. Dub is a reggae subgenre that relies a lot on automatin fx and mutes. My mix of this song went in that direction. Lots of delay and reverb throws, some ear candy putting phaser on reverb tails, etc.
Please comment on others mixes, this site is all about feedback.
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#6
No offence man! Wrote that really just because don't want to behave as an hypcrite without knowing it.

Thanx for the automation in reggae informations! Anyway, don't get me wrong, listened to some reggae and dub, even played it (just reggae) with my bands, just never mixed it. That's different, for example hearing the raw tracks didn't get it was dub at all, and mixed it as if it was a classic reggae song. That would have been a big mistake in a real work... (even if, probably, the artist would have told me that).
When I will open again the mix (don't know when) I'll try to make it dub and will take your good mix for inspiration!
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#7
Added a bit of automations for subtle movement, nothing special or experimental as other mixes I've heard on the forum, but I think it's improved from first version.
Also did the organ correction suggested by Jeremias, as well as other changes too.
If you have any suggestions i will try to improve it more.

Marco


.mp3    Arise - Run run run_B_Master mp3.mp3 --  (Download: 7.54 MB)


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#8
hi Marco,
firstly, thanks for dropping by and giving my mix your ear and taking some time with it.

i noted that the genre is new to you? i think it's always a good idea to push the boundaries and explore, so well done in exploring. i'm wondering how much time you've been able to spend in discovering the genre, from a research perspective? if something is new to you, it's important to check out the scene and see what the trends are, what's changed over the years, the levels of instruments in the mix, checking out the kind of reverbs that have been employed (i.e. how the depth field has been worked), and all that kind of stuff. i think it also goes without saying, that the research should involve the best quality material (NOT highly compressed mp3, because of the artifacts) so your ears can tune into quality from the start. when you've researched, you will be in a really strong position to begin mixing. if we launch straight into a project without doing the research, we would be guilty of complacency, and that doesn't make for good mixers Wink Now having said that, it doesn't mean that you can't explore and "do your own thing" - there are no rules....but some people do have expectations and as a mixing engineer, you need to know who you're target listener is going to be so you can help meet those expectations. this forum offers fantastic opportunity to take some risks and explore new terrain.

do you have a good pair of headphones?

i use headphones for listening to forum posts (HD560's, which i bought new back in 1992) because they can reveal some issues that have often escaped the mixer. headphones have their weaknesses; assessing bass is one of them, and assessing depth is another. a key point is the fact that when listening with monitors, the mix is 60 degrees wide, but in headphones it becomes 180 degrees, so the sound-stage appears much wider with them. because we don't know whether our audience is on headphones or monitors, we need to check how the mix behaves in both listening environments.

bass instruments (i deem bass to be anything below 200Hz, roughly speaking) should be central in a mix generally speaking. with this in mind, take a listen to both your v1 and v2 mixes again and assess the changes and implications of your decisions. in your v1 mix, there was less low-level bass present out towards the sides, yet in v2 there's rather a lot (in other words, i thought v1 was good, v2 less so). your v2 mix in headphones, could make for uncomfortable listening to the point that it becomes fatiguing? furthermore, because bass is non-directional, putting unnecessary bass out to the sides means the woofer is working harder than it needs to. this also means that if the woofer is trying to deliver bass off to one side, then it is less able to deliver the mid range with any degree of accuracy (read up on speaker technology to understand the issues) and then distortion will occur. the main instrument that's problematic in your v2 mix, is the organ....where you've panned the lower action to the RHS.

i'd describe your mix as being warm, and i'm wondering if it's your monitors that's tending to skew the mix in this direction (perhaps they are overly bright in delivery, which would cause you to mix darker to compensate?), or whether it was a choice you made from the start? that's not a criticism, more of an observation. personally, i'd have liked more mid range stuff going on in order to compensate a little for the bass element(s), and this would have helped provide better clarity in the instruments. for example, we are all very familiar with how a piano should sound.....but i can appreciate creative decisions/reasons might cause one to give it more of a warm presence. i'd only say that one should be aware of the other instrument's frequency response within the mix, and also flag up the psychoacoustic effects on the listener when they are being somewhat deprived of treble - it suggests the instrument is further back in the mix, even if it isn't and it can be this ambiguity that distracts a listener. but i can't help feeling your low-mids are overly abundant, which is easy to do given the bass guitar's presence in Raggae.

what are you using for monitors? is your room bright and highly reflective?

overall, i thought you did a good job given this was your first go at the genre.

catch you laters
Dave

Beware...........Cognitive Dissonance!
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#9
Wow thank you very much for the detailed (and well explained) observations you did!
I must say this site is really working for me, i'm finding here all the help i'm in need for and that i wouldn't get in other ways. I hope i will learn all i can from this chance.

I'll try to explain my actual condition and my aims so maybe you can have suggestions on that too - sorry if it takes long -.
As you can hear i have very little experience in mixing, made some studies and studio assistance (with good teachers), have read books, internet forums, interviews, video tutorials and any information i could get. Now i feel i got some theoretical know how, but lacking much practice experiences (and i think that's where you really learn this job, theory being just the background).
As a consequence I'm now getting through a hard critical revision of everything i previously used to do just because i was taught that. That's what i'm experimenting with in this forum's mixes at the moment, still not really looking for a good mix as primary aim, rather to learn to hear the benefits of those things and become able to choose if to use a technique or not and how much.
For example the bass frequencies stereo issue you mentioned: i have the habit to collapse all the bass frequencies to mono with a plugin in the master bus and not thinking to that kind of problems anymore during mixing, but honestly, when that plugin's off, i often can't hear the necessity of it (can hear difference but can't tell it is better, even on laptop or headphones). I want to avoid unnecessary processing, so in version B i just tried to get rid of it and see what happens. And the problems raised! I'm very happy you told me this, now that i had the issue pointed i'll think to this mix when approaching low freq stereo field in future. One theoretical thing confirmed by experience, nothing more to ask for! Couldn't have the chance to listen to my mix on headphones, as i gave them to a friend, but i will do and check what you meant. About that, i usually listen to mixes the day after on headphones, mainly to have a different listening environment (don't have secondary speakers) and also to check what happens on headphones, but that habit too never led me to make corrections in the mix, so i was starting to ask myself if it is really so necessary - answer: yes it is.
Similar thing for the warmth issue. Can't say it's my speakers - dynaudio bm5a - or room's fault, that's me unfortunately, my ears like warmer tones (must educate myself on that). I know that and usually try to compensate taking decisions oriented on the bright side (still not able to do it properly untill it will come natural to me). Looked for experimental confirmation - version A should be a bit brighter if i remember - which i had from you again.

I will make another try with this mix, i'll try to:
- pan low organ to center position and collapse mix low frequencies to mono (just to be safe)
- more mids/less lows on piano and other midrange instruments
- look for a brighter mix

Other issues i should correct? Something wrong with the rim/kick couple, bass or overall dynamics?
I'll be happy to receive further indications, and again, thanks a lot i believe i will learn much from this sharing experience.
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#10
Tried to do those corrections (ended up muting the low organ track), also made some other tweaks, hope it's better now.
Opinions and indications are welcome as always!


.mp3    Arise - Run run run_C.mp3 --  (Download: 7.54 MB)


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