Pain Remains Mix

[Philip]

hi everyone...... 
what do u think guys about this two tracks ,M1 is much louder than N9 

Your FeedBack Please .....

[SonicTramp]

I think the snare is sweet, snappy and commanding. That's the type of sound from a snare I am always looking for in, almost, any mix. The kick is there but a bit obscure and, w/o the beater to help, make it hard for the ear to lock on. I think some of the low end can use a bit more clean up, around 100-200Hz, mostly on the low synths and guitars. That way I think the kick will show a bit more meat and a slight boost on top should reveal more beater and, possibly, make the guitars a bit punchier (less mud). Or sometimes I just LP on the low spectrum instruments (bass, bass synth, cello, etc) just a little bit and make good improvement on the attack of the snare and the kick, mostly on the beater. Vocal sounds nice and clear. Maybe a bit less reverb and/or shorten the ringing of the crash? Just a few suggestions. Hope it helps.

[Philip]

I think the snare is sweet, snappy and commanding. That's the type of sound from a snare I am always looking for in, almost, any mix. The kick is there but a bit obscure and, w/o the beater to help, make it hard for the ear to lock on. I think some of the low end can use a bit more clean up, around 100-200Hz, mostly on the low synths and guitars. That way I think the kick will show a bit more meat and a slight boost on top should reveal more beater and, possibly, make the guitars a bit punchier (less mud). Or sometimes I just LP on the low spectrum instruments (bass, bass synth, cello, etc) just a little bit and make good improvement on the attack of the snare and the kick, mostly on the beater. Vocal sounds nice and clear. Maybe a bit less reverb and/or shorten the ringing of the crash? Just a few suggestions. Hope it helps.

Thank you so much for this helpfull comment,,,,,, ill try and fix some things arround 

cheers

[SonicTramp]

The second mix is much nicer. Very skillful. Yep, now I can hear the kick like the way it's supposed to sound. Cleaning out the low end also helped brighten up the snare too, which is awesome, right? I think you should spend more time with the guitars. I know they played more power chords (sustain) but there are some open string picking (attack) that makes the part more powerful. The other guitars, tho played very briefly, are very important to the parts and I don't hear the as clearly and powerful as they should be. I thought the lo end cleaning would help the guitars more than the snare but it didn't turn out that way. Either that or you didn't clean it up enough. Sometimes our mixes get better slowly and incrementally, but that's not something you didn't know already. The second mix still is an improvement. Cheers!

And I guess after you do all that why not put the pedal to the metal and make your mix as loud as possible w/o destroying it. I am curious as to how loud can you do actually.

[Philip]

hey Sonic.....thanks again Mate!
Yes! I agree 100% and you are all the way Right!
shortly i would like to say that i mixed it on an old laptop from 2015 with 4 GB Ram (very old one hahahaha)
i was about to ReAmp the guitar to give more Shimmer Ishhh sound but i don't have any on this laptop lol....
beside that i am sure the CPU could not handle it 
thats why i have No Automation at all ( i tried to but... it stuck )
anyway once i get home ill mix it in my studio a ( pro one)
To be Honest i don't know how to mix with headphones ( the way i mixed this oone)

and your question about loud i can go with this mix . the answer is Alot louder but i can't determine manything with headphones
my master hit at -9/10 DB so i can push it alot ..... u can put your vol up as much as u want in case you want to hear it more bright
so i prefer to send it to mastering like this ,and give another ears to make the loud 

at the final i pushed the laptop to the limits hehehehhe so fixing things up would be at the Studio not on this setup

i Am wondered how ppl can mix on pair of Headphones ???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

again....... Thank you Sir

[SonicTramp]

Yeah, man. 4GB nowadays is not gonna cut it, like riding a bike with loose chain, doesn't really work but not completely fail either. I don't have it better than you either, old beat up laptop 2013 but 8GB RAM, slightly better so it's not too bad.

In my experience the less you have on your chain the better. I used to max out 10 slots on my inserts and still even complained, softly, and wished I had 20 instead. Now even 4 is too many. If I have to put more than 4 on a track, then whatever it is it requires a second listen. I also do a lot more editing than before bc I can hear more now. It is a very important step. The pros don't have an army of assistants just hanging around smoking weed, right? I just wonder what exactly do they edit though. It's still a mystery to me. Maybe you can come up with a list of what to look out for when you edit and I'll do the same and see if we can come up with something new? We both may learn some things from one another.

I think you can mix on both, monitors and cans. It's just a matter of getting to know the sound they make and how they respond to your ears. Good hearing and knowing what to look for are the main ingredients. I started out with cans but didn't do too well bc I couldnt hear anything, didn't know what to look for and was quite clumsy with tools. Yep, very deadly combination. Needless to say, all my mixes smelled badly, reeked with whatever you don't like. They still smell bad now, just a little less. But I do mix using both, each a different purpose. Someday I wish I can switch to headphone permanently.

Here's my list of what to look out for when editing, feel free (anyone) to add to it (not in order of importance):
1. Click, pops
2. timing
3. level inconsistency
4. Phasing
5. Gain staging
6. Grouping
7. Location memory
8. Tracks coloring
9. Gating (why not?)

[Philip]

Hi man...
Wellllll yeah 4 GB doing nothing nowadays!!!!!
i still prefer the analog domain.... and still mixing on a console..... DAW for me is like a tape machine.....so i go 3-4 plugins at the Max.
my check and edit list is pretty much like yours
and my flow is going like that......
when someone send me a project to mix
First listeing. am looking for any sound issues ,if there somthing wrong with the recording i'll send it back to Rerecording or simply ignoring the project .
in case eveything are ok then ill start coloring the tracks /  Groups / Auxes / and get connected to my starting delay / reverb . plus Cleaing and cutting things out 
 i'll play it again and start balacing the tracks (channels in my case ) going with the Input Knobs to faders and what i call it (First Eq ) and for sure i play all the channels  ( all play together).  Once i get a cool starting mix then the creativity part starts
and you say Gating ! somthing that i like and for me it is usefullllllll........
i do alot of sidechain to trigger effects or another channel/s to make more space or one an Eq dose not work out the way u like......it is simply unlimited options and so creativity....
hahhahaha i can spend hours writing down the way i get into a mix.....u know what?! many times i forgot to clean things from few tracks even forgetting to fade in/out loool ....and i just got a great mixes thou
tahts why i will never Fix things in a mix

So...... Great Recording will Put your mix on the HighEnd stage

[SonicTramp]

My mixing beginning started in the digital domain. That's the only world I know. I heard many arguments about the quality diff and bc I don't know enough I just stay on the sideline and will side with the winner in the end. But that's not my worries right now. I want to take care of the technical side of mixing first. Divide and conquer is my current strategy.

Well, I hope our edit list is complete and that nothing else is missing or we both will be in big trouble. An incomplete list produces incomplete tasks. Nobody likes a half-baked mix, right?

I think the gate is just as wonderful as the EQ and compressor and limiter. I use it whenever I need it, even on the stereo bus.

I laughed when you mentioned the things you forgot in your mixes. I do the same, and worse, forgot to unmute and completely missed it until someone pointed it out for me. But that happens less often now. I do make an effort to check, using both eyes and ears now. I guess that's part of what we call experience. Someday (better sooner than later) that type of error should be completely eliminated, or else, right?

Right now I have my ears set on loudness. And yeah, man, it's much harder than I thought (nothing new here), but I think I know what to do. I just need more time messing with it. I'll post it on my thread. Take a listen if you have time. Thx

[Philip]

Hey ,,,,
yep..... for me Still a big Diff between both worlds Digi and analog. once you start playin with effects and daynamics u'll find things goes smoother with fatness and rounded well .... actually will help u to make things louder as much as u want
in general i use Gates for SURE! . on this mix i used gate on the bass triggered from the Kick same for compressors as wel
this will help things to sound more Musical if u want,,,,,and it Does support the rythm too and make things dancy

u have to know everything about your Fav Plugins or analog Gear. 
Eq's
Copressors
Limiters
Gates
etc.......
one of my Fav ways for mixing  is to build a wide image ,which is the background or what we call it the ( landscape ) of your mix, building it with your effects Delays and Reverbs,,,,,make everthing balanced well and clear like a glass board
then using you direct mic channels to pop a bit above this glass ( imagin it like stretched sheet) between you monitors
once u get it this way then u'll nail it the way u want and will never have any problems with balanc / loudness /and pumpy daynamics and much more.....

Cherrs.....

[SonicTramp]

Yeah, I know of the kick/bass gate triggering trick (learned that either from some books or some dudes on the net, but not here. Very little of that here disappointingly). I don't use it for this song but still think it's a clever trick. I would never be able to come up with that. I use it whenever I can for sure.

No, I don't put FX while I am mixing anymore. I used to try it but I couldn't handle it so off it went. I put FX last. My reason is simple, why take on more than necessary. I wait until the end and settle. That's when I decide the height, the width, and the depth of my mix. That's when I decide to use how many reverb, delay, etc...Unless each instrument has its own FX chain, I think mixing and putting FX while doing it do more harm than good, at least in my case. For example, snare and guitars need different reverb setting, delay setting, etc. try to do it while introducing more instrument brings more confusion and make the ears work too hard (still in my case). I used to do that and my mixes smell so very bad. It works for you bc maybe you have better hearing than I did then. I'd love to hear a convincing argument for it tho. After all, not everything I think turns out to be right.