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my take on Prodigal
#1
It's beyond me why the released version is so compressed and saturated. I must be unfashionable, I dunno. Do clients really want this? I'm never asked to go this route, thankfully.

It's nicely performed and recorded. I'm not a fan of the Glyn Johns method myself - it was kinda hard to control floor tom boominess, but it worked out.


Anyways, this is my no-fuss mix of Prodigal. I've used amp sims for all guitar tracks, but number 4: the originals were nice but I envisioned them a bit different.

I did apply saturation to bass and bass drum to try to make 'em translate to smaller speakers, don't know if it worked well enough. They're pretty deep.


Any comments? Let's chat!


Post scriptum: updated version! : )


.mp3    Prodigal 14.12.20.a.mp3 --  (Download: 7.28 MB)


.mp3    Prodigal 16.12.20.a.mp3 --  (Download: 7.28 MB)


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#2
You're right that it was pretty compressed and saturated. In my defense it was the first session I had in a while and one that I did for the first time with Logic and several new plug ins. Mastering, which was out of my hands added to it a bit but I take the brunt of the responsibility. Still, I think it works. And yeah, the clients were happy with it. It was a pretty casual project recorded in a basement with a max of 4 inputs at a time and a lot of limitations so while I'll admit to some failings I'd still say I'm proud of the end result considering. Plus I kinda like compression and saturation.

That said your mix is definitely really good. No real complaints if maybe it's a little 'safe'. Which might be what's called for. I might be too close to it m'self.
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#3
(15-12-2020, 06:39 PM)RoyM Wrote: You're right that it was pretty compressed and saturated. In my defense it was the first session I had in a while and one that I did for the first time with Logic and several new plug ins. Mastering, which was out of my hands added to it a bit but I take the brunt of the responsibility. Still, I think it works. And yeah, the clients were happy with it. It was a pretty casual project recorded in a basement with a max of 4 inputs at a time and a lot of limitations so while I'll admit to some failings I'd still say I'm proud of the end result considering. Plus I kinda like compression and saturation.

That said your mix is definitely really good. No real complaints if maybe it's a little 'safe'. Which might be what's called for. I might be too close to it m'self.

RoyM, thanks for the tracks and the quick answer!

I didn't mean to attack in any way, no need for you to speak in your defense. It turned out nice, then: the end result is not my cup of tea, but the band was happy, that's what matters.

I really do find almost physically offensive the level of distortion I hear (it's pretty frequent), so I go the way of my liking. I guess you can say it's safe indeed, but it's a pretty song ain't it? I don't know from where to extract edge without making it sound forced and distasteful, speaking inside my own view of the matter. Maybe some parallel compression on the drums? I dunno, would you hint me? Willing to try. : )


Anyways, glad you liked it!
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#4
No bottom end in the mix,i cant actually hear a kick what i do hear sounds out of phase , and the bass is really low
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#5
(16-12-2020, 01:26 AM)takka360 Wrote: No bottom end in the mix,i cant actually hear a kick what i do hear sounds out of phase , and the bass is really low
I dunno. I think the low end works. The out of phase-ness might be a flaw in the original tracks. I mean, I think I remember the kick being in phase but with a GJ setup it doesn't always hit everything at the same time. I suppose that's partially why the kick was relatively high in the original mix, to compensate for the leakage into the "Overheads". Personally I kinda like the kick tone. The bass has a pretty low tone (the bassist liked his tone knob turned down) so in this song a solid low end focused bass guitar with a wider, more open kick could work.
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#6
(16-12-2020, 12:18 AM)Bruno Corrêa Wrote:
(15-12-2020, 06:39 PM)RoyM Wrote: You're right that it was pretty compressed and saturated. In my defense it was the first session I had in a while and one that I did for the first time with Logic and several new plug ins. Mastering, which was out of my hands added to it a bit but I take the brunt of the responsibility. Still, I think it works. And yeah, the clients were happy with it. It was a pretty casual project recorded in a basement with a max of 4 inputs at a time and a lot of limitations so while I'll admit to some failings I'd still say I'm proud of the end result considering. Plus I kinda like compression and saturation.

That said your mix is definitely really good. No real complaints if maybe it's a little 'safe'. Which might be what's called for. I might be too close to it m'self.

RoyM, thanks for the tracks and the quick answer!

I didn't mean to attack in any way, no need for you to speak in your defense. It turned out nice, then: the end result is not my cup of tea, but the band was happy, that's what matters.

I really do find almost physically offensive the level of distortion I hear (it's pretty frequent), so I go the way of my liking. I guess you can say it's safe indeed, but it's a pretty song ain't it? I don't know from where to extract edge without making it sound forced and distasteful, speaking inside my own view of the matter. Maybe some parallel compression on the drums? I dunno, would you hint me? Willing to try. : )


Anyways, glad you liked it!
No attack felt, I get it. And you're certainly entitled to your view and generally I agree and/or how it would be perceived differently. It is a song that one could see being a bit lighter and more natural. The artist does like a little more...je ne sais qui in their sound. I think they just like it and also don't want to come across as being a "folk" band. So they like the extra push overall. They want the songs to take you somewhere as opposed to being natural. Did I over do it? Yeah, probably, but not regretfully. Considering everything it sounds like a record.

I'm not certain what you mean by "physically offensive the level of distortion". Distortion is a bit of a interpretive word so I'm not certain what you're referencing exacting. The guitars? The overall mix? We recorded all the guitars direct and they left the tones up to me and I may have picked some more aggressive than necessary tones. I'm still not great with amp emulators and at the time I was just getting back into it with some new plug ins. If there's distortion on the overall mix then yes maybe there was some saturation or who knows what overall to help glue it all together. Anyway. It's hard to say.

I think in the end, mix this one as you hear it (as you did) and that's ok. It's tricky. It should be a band but not feel like a band. It should paint a picture as opposed to creating an image. I know that makes little sense. I didn't sleep well last night.
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#7
I've read the drummer was playing metal before, right? Anyways, I used distortion as synonym for saturation regarding the overall mix. By "almost physically offensive" I simply meant that it's very unpleasant to me. Lots of friends and colleagues go down that route, though, and we also have debates over it.


So... Slightly shifting gears, I present a new mix! I feel it is improved, really appreciate the talk that led me to where it is (hey, takka360, you didn't go unnoticed!). I hinted about my concern over the bass and kick drum, you guys pushed me forward.

For the bass I went bananas on the equaliser and used a overdrive (going for a busted speaker low level distortion) but in the end it didn't change quite like I was hoping for (the source must've been really toned down like you said). The bass drum was also redone from scratch, it earned some kick and more focused lows.


Hope you both endorse it! : )

And go have some quality sleep!


.mp3    Prodigal 16.12.20.a.mp3 --  (Download: 7.28 MB)


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#8
Ha. You know more about the drummer than I do! To be fair, over the time I've worked wit them they've had at least 4 drummers. They're essentially a duo with some hired guns and I can't recall exactly what the background was of the guy who played on this. A lovely fellow and a fine drummer. Other than that it's a bit of a blur.

As far as saturation, fair enough. I suppose that's a personal preference and I kind of like some saturation. Maybe it's just being used to tape. I dunno. I don't know what I may have used on the mix bus and no idea what was done in 'mastering'.

The new mix is an improvement but that's not to say the old one needed one. Again, no complaints but this one feels a bit more dynamic. The pannings feels more obvious to me in a good way. Not sure it was even changed but I noticed it more now. The bass sounds good but honestly the distortion effect doesn't jump out. But it doesn't need to. As you have it sounds good. Maybe it translates more on smaller speakers. It's fine. It's a pretty dark sounding bass so doing anything to make it stand out more is fair.

Sounds great. Good job.
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#9
Loads better .i literally couldn't hear the kick in the mix at all and the bass was so low especially on my small desktop speakers
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