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All Souls Moon - no plugins - Olli H
#11
Beautiful well balanced mix.
Even the vocals in bas solo sound great. I did a lot o eq automation on that part today, some phrases were much too bright, and you placed keys tastefully to support the solo.

Only thing to suggest is the modulation effect on violin. I would like a tiny more 4-5 k and maybe little 300 too and no modulation. Maybe use that on one piano instead ?
Voice sounds bonedry and I realise its modern, but I think it will shine with a little well choosen verb

But those unimportant suggestions doesnt change the great mix you allready have. Just my ears talkin. Congrats on great work.
Old ears, old gear, little boy inside love music and sounds and my wife, not necessarily in that order
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#12
Good points, Voelund. I made a new version.

(18-12-2013, 02:19 AM)Voelund Wrote: Only thing to suggest is the modulation effect on violin. I would like a tiny more 4-5 k and maybe little 300 too and no modulation. Maybe use that on one piano instead ?

I added little sparkle too the violin, and diminished modulation.

I'm still in the mood of trying modulation everywhere. But I don't want to hear it. When I was a small kid (well, I'm still), I disliked all those bands who added flanger- and choruse-pedals to their guitars. So maybe that's why I have to rehabilitate myself to modulation effects.

(18-12-2013, 02:19 AM)Voelund Wrote: Voice sounds bonedry and I realise its modern, but I think it will shine with a little well choosen verb

I think almost any mix can be made with no reverb on vocals, or with lot of vocals, or anything in between. But that big decision alters the way other instruments should be mixed. If I were in position to keep mixing lessons, as a one practice I would demand to make two different mixes of the same song: one with extremely wet vocals and other one with very dry vocals.

In this case I wanted the vocals too be bonedry for some reason, but maybe the result was too dry in the context. It became almost as dry as the mixer himself. But in the new version I added just a little bit of hall to vocals to tie the syllables together. (But I kept the three different modulations that I had added to vocals Smile As I said, I'm attending a rehab camp to learn the greatness of modulation)




.mp3    All-souls-moon-olli-h-2013-12-19.mp3 --  (Download: 8.27 MB)


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#13
And the one answering your post used to put verb on literally evrything when I got my first Korg one unit verb in the mid 80s.
Im in rehab too, but a diffrent one. The vocal modulation were so discrete I didnt notice. Maybe thats why voice sounds great in your mix. Look forward to hear it when I get home and get in my music cave. All this unimportant life business steal time doesnt it Big Grin
Old ears, old gear, little boy inside love music and sounds and my wife, not necessarily in that order
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#14
(19-12-2013, 12:34 PM)Voelund Wrote: Maybe thats why voice sounds great in your mix.
The main secrect in vocal sound is: I did almost nothing with EQ.
- smooth hi-pass at 77Hz
- little air at 14.5K with 4.4 Q-setting.
Nothing else with EQ

I'm trying to overcome the bad habbit of overusing EQ. Very difficult, but I don't want to be spending my time in EQ Rehab Clinic.

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#15
HI,

what a great discussion point, it's really nice to have someone bringing up a mix like this.

In brazil we do not have a sound engineering course, so a have to use the internt and try to find as much goodwill people I can to help me.

I've been boring one of brazilian best P.A. tech (as we call they here) called Denio Costa. And he has been teaching me the secrets of his live mix.

I got impressed because they sound very much to this mix of yours. He rarely uses compressor, gates and eq. He says if we have and Optmized sound system, good mics ang great musicians there is almost no need of those things.

what do you think?
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#16
You can always do a good rough mix without any EQ or compressors if - and only if - the tracks have been recorded in good quality. That usually implies EQ and compression on the way to the mixtape (or harddisk, in modern days), so the tracks sound good as is.

In homerecordings we usually do not find that, unfortunately. And everybody expects that the mixer fixes it in the mix. Sad

Olli, the background vocals should be processed separately in the bridge as they take the role of the lead vocal there. In your mix they sound muffled.

Other than that your mix sounds nice and warm. Not the way I would prefer to mix it, but still a good listen.

Regards,
Steffen
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#17
@ JO COMETA
Live system is certainly different situation because there one can have huge difference between soft parts and very loud parts. And furthermor, some great live musicians can do a very good "pre-compressions" by the way they use their microphones. Willie Nelson certainly has his reasons to turn his head in a certain way in loud words. Some great bluegrass bands can do a great live recording with just one microphone on the stage. The dance around that mic and change the balance by adjusting the distance to that one mic. So I agree with your friends idea of not using automatically eqs and compressors etc.

But the huge dynamic range of live situations just don't work with CDs. If one wants to listen CD in car, the dynamic range should be much narrower. Otherwise one cannot hear anything of the soft parts.

@ stoman
About mixing: I agree with Stoman that almost always in real life situations one must use EQ. If one happens to be multigrammy winning Al Schmitt with best microphones, best rooms, best studios, best ears and best experience, and one happens to be in charge of both recording and mixing, then on can follow his technique: "I use very little compression and very little EQ. I let the microphones do that."
http://www.bobbyowsinski.com/recording-e...cerpt.html

As I said earlier, I always try to do the quick rough mix without plugins (or with just a little bit of high passing), just to get acquainted with the song and natural sounds of the chosen instruments. So, at first I want to be guided by them, before I start to force them to my preconceptions about how they should sound. But certainly I'm not trying to do the final mix that way.

With this song the recording must have been done by a very good engineer, as the sound and the balance of the song came out quite nicely without any plugins. That's why I wanted to share also the rough mix.
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#18
Listening to your mix made me inspired to take a crack at it. I followed your instrument placement. It gave me that you are their feel. Only set fader levels and panning. No track plugins and no automation. Let me know what you think.


.mp3    All Souls Moon ALX Mix.mp3 --  (Download: 8.38 MB)


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#19
Sounds great to me. Now you have a great rough mix. Next step is to make it even better with same well targeted plugins. Especially some muddiness should be taken care of. And just a little bit of reverb here and there, and you'll have great finished mix.

Start your own thread for your mix, and I'll come commenting it to there. If you don't hear about me, just remind me here. Smile
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