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Quicksand - HB Mix
#1
Great song, really well recorded. Pleasure to mix
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New version, see below, HB Mix 1.1. Some small changes


.mp3    Quicksand_HB Mix 1.0.mp3 --  (Download: 5.99 MB)


Be fierce in your encouragement, kind in your criticism and try and remember that the art of a good critique is not to make someone else's mix sound like yours...but to help the mixer realize their own vision.

https://soundcloud.com/hbguitar
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#2
Balances are great.
Great vox sound.
Intersting overall sound with specifi texture.
Great mix.


Here’s some nitpicking.

In the opening fro 0:26 onwards, both dark guitar and kick/toms are on the left side. During that time the right side feels a bit empty. After 0:40 it’s not a problem any more.

After 0.46 I wonder it the wall of guitars is pumping a bit. As if the vox is pulling them down quite much and then they recover quite slowly when vox disappears.

Something bothers me with guitars. As if they have some sort of mid-rangy peak in them. Is the space of guitars honky or what causes it?
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#3
(30-04-2016, 08:11 AM)Olli H Wrote: Balances are great.
Great vox sound.
Intersting overall sound with specifi texture.
Great mix.

Thx Olli..glad u liked itSmile

(30-04-2016, 08:11 AM)Olli H Wrote: Here’s some nitpicking.

I love the nitpicking.....it makes us better mixers

(30-04-2016, 08:11 AM)Olli H Wrote: In the opening fro 0:26 onwards, both dark guitar and kick/toms are on the left side. During that time the right side feels a bit empty. After 0:40 it’s not a problem any more.

yes, i tried the balance several ways but i liked this one the best. I've been listening to lots of Andrew Scheps mixes recently and he often leaves one side empty if he needs/wants to during verses or quiet phrases..this is my homage to him

(30-04-2016, 08:11 AM)Olli H Wrote: After 0.46 I wonder it the wall of guitars is pumping a bit. As if the vox is pulling them down quite much and then they recover quite slowly when vox disappears.

i think this will be an easy fix.....I'll adjust the threshold and release settings so its not so obvious

(30-04-2016, 08:11 AM)Olli H Wrote: Something bothers me with guitars. As if they have some sort of mid-rangy peak in them. Is the space of guitars honky or what causes it?

i'll check that out

cheers, Simon

Be fierce in your encouragement, kind in your criticism and try and remember that the art of a good critique is not to make someone else's mix sound like yours...but to help the mixer realize their own vision.

https://soundcloud.com/hbguitar
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#4
Hi Simon ,
Great solid sounding mix, As Olli already mentioned the guitars sound just a touch honky around 800-1-5k area.

Cheers Big Grin

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#5
(30-04-2016, 11:27 AM)thedon Wrote: Hi Simon ,
Great solid sounding mix, As Olli already mentioned the guitars sound just a touch honky around 800-1-5k area.

Cheers Big Grin

Hey Don, thx mate. Glad u enjoyed it.

re guitars.....gotta laugh....i did give them a small 2db boost at 800hz just to nudge them forward...cant get away with anything anymoreBig Grin

cheers
Be fierce in your encouragement, kind in your criticism and try and remember that the art of a good critique is not to make someone else's mix sound like yours...but to help the mixer realize their own vision.

https://soundcloud.com/hbguitar
Reply
#6
(30-04-2016, 11:23 AM)HbGuitar Wrote: I love the nitpicking.....it makes us better mixers
Yes, I like also nitpicking, but quite often I dare not to do that. I have seen too many inflamed discussions around here and I don’t want to participate in them.

Nitpicking is quite diffucult, because one never knows when one enters area of taste or artistic choise. BUT if every now and then we had a common technical task with same reference, then we could rehearse hearing a most minor details and discuss about them. Just for the sake of learning the art of mixing. For example ”Make these track sound exactly like CLA’s mix”, then we would be extending our hearing limits and we could be finding new essential details and nuances from the mixing process that we probably won’t find if we just follow our undeveloped artistic taste or vision.

And then fi someone comments ”your kick has too much low end”, then it would not be a subjective evaluation (”your taste is bad and mine is excellent”), but rather it would mean ”when I compare you mix to CLA’s mix, your kick has much more low end”.

Maybe we could establish a club of Nitpicking Patreons and sometimes try to do a common mixing task. Just to practice the art of listening. I’m sure we could find nice tasks for our selves. I think it would be worth of trying. Most of the time it would be enough to find one excellent top quality reference for a chosen song, and then go together towards that sound. Sometimes the task could be more specific: ”create similar drum sound”. Or whatever.

Anyone interested?
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#7
Hey Simon, long time.

I don't know if I even believe it's possible to completely separate personal taste and objective truth when it comes to mixing. Over my years of learning audio, I've heard too many kick drums, guitars, and everything elses that sound starkly different.

Having said that, 800 is a bit of a danger zone for electric guitars IMHO. That general frequency area tends to be pretty dynamic in most guitars I've heard, so boosting it comes at the risk of making the sound a little uneven . Often I find it prudent to get a frequency selective compressor working in that region before I try boosting it to avoid the occasional mid range honk.

That's not necessarily the case in your mix... just contributing to the discussion Smile
I'm grateful for comments and suggestions. Thank you for listening!
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#8
(30-04-2016, 05:49 PM)Olli H Wrote: Yes, I like also nitpicking, but quite often I dare not to do that. I have seen too many inflamed discussions around here and I don’t want to participate in them.

Amen to that brotherSmile

(30-04-2016, 05:49 PM)Olli H Wrote: Nitpicking is quite diffucult, because one never knows when one enters area of taste or artistic choise.

agreed....especially if you've already spent hours working on the same session...one very quickly develops a biased view on how it should sound and often it comes as quite a surprise when one hears a mix that has gone in a very different direction

It can be very difficult to listen to a mix from the mixers perspective and add constructive feedback on how to improve the mix from that perspective. Much of the advice I read on the forum is often one mixer telling another mixer how to make the mix sound like theirs...

(30-04-2016, 05:49 PM)Olli H Wrote: BUT if every now and then we had a common technical task with same reference, then we could rehearse hearing a most minor details and discuss about them. Just for the sake of learning the art of mixing. For example ”Make these track sound exactly like CLA’s mix”, then we would be extending our hearing limits and we could be finding new essential details and nuances from the mixing process that we probably won’t find if we just follow our undeveloped artistic taste or vision.

And then fi someone comments ”your kick has too much low end”, then it would not be a subjective evaluation (”your taste is bad and mine is excellent”), but rather it would mean ”when I compare you mix to CLA’s mix, your kick has much more low end”.

I read a quote once from an award winning major label pro mixer legend - cant remember their name, who said something like "the hard work in mixing begins once you start to reference your sources." And they didn't mean make this song sound like that song...its much more subtle that that...its more like make this kick sound like that kick, make that vocal air sound like this vocal air ...so you end up referencing multiple tracks by multiple artists to build a unique reference picture of the session at hand

(30-04-2016, 05:49 PM)Olli H Wrote: Maybe we could establish a club of Nitpicking Patreons and sometimes try to do a common mixing task. Just to practice the art of listening. I’m sure we could find nice tasks for our selves. I think it would be worth of trying. Most of the time it would be enough to find one excellent top quality reference for a chosen song, and then go together towards that sound. Sometimes the task could be more specific: ”create similar drum sound”. Or whatever.

Anyone interested?

For sure...that sounds like fun. Doing something with other Patreon members could be really good. Maybe we could approach Mike and ask him to set up a separate section within the forum
Be fierce in your encouragement, kind in your criticism and try and remember that the art of a good critique is not to make someone else's mix sound like yours...but to help the mixer realize their own vision.

https://soundcloud.com/hbguitar
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#9
(30-04-2016, 08:48 PM)pauli Wrote: Hey Simon, long time.

Yo Pauli (in my best fake NJ accent) - how you doing?

(30-04-2016, 08:48 PM)pauli Wrote: I don't know if I even believe it's possible to completely separate personal taste and objective truth when it comes to mixing. Over my years of learning audio, I've heard too many kick drums, guitars, and everything elses that sound starkly different.

Once an engineer achieves a certain skill level, its all about taste, and the best engineers build up reputations for being curators of good taste - the keepers of the keys so to speak. That's why the top guns are in such demand.

Good to have you backBig Grin

Cheers, Simon
Be fierce in your encouragement, kind in your criticism and try and remember that the art of a good critique is not to make someone else's mix sound like yours...but to help the mixer realize their own vision.

https://soundcloud.com/hbguitar
Reply
#10
I'm doing alright... been away too long. Bought a house with my wife and it's been busy getting the place ready for my family and getting my room suitable to mix. I have acoustic treatment misadventures to share with anyone interested Tongue

The key thing I've realized about mixing over the last year or so is that really, taste is everything after a point. It's been difficult engaging with the discussions lately because so much of what I have to offer is really my opinion more than anything else.

Getting everything balanced, audible, and reasonably clean is a pretty easy task, ultimately. But doing so in good taste is not so easy. So who am I to tell someone with basically the same background and experience and me that his mix bus compressor (or whatever else) is killing the song?

So these days, I try to focus more on whether or not the music itself is working rather than what it sounds like... that's really more important than anything else.
I'm grateful for comments and suggestions. Thank you for listening!
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