First of all thanks to Tal for giving us the multitrack for this song, it's really cool to see Forkupines release some new material! Over the past week I have been messing around with the track in my off time to see what I could come up with and this is the result. I left out the backing vocal track and guitars 4 and 5 ( it seems like guitars 4 and 5 didn't really add a lot to the song). I used the trigger tracks so that I could use my own samples, the samples that came with the track were nice but I wanted to go after a more modern rock sound out of the drums. The samples are from Ezdrummer 2 (Nashville 22" PB Plastic Beater Kick, and Metal Machine 6.5"x14" Dunnett Titanium Snare and Ludwig Stainless Steel Rack (12"x15") Tom and Floor (16"x18") Tom). During the bridge and final Chorus I added some sub drops to change things up and during the final pre chorus I removed the bass and guitar but left the shout vocal and the drums. When mixing the bass I used more of the Sansamp bass and blended in the DI to add some clarity, neither one on there own was great but together they had a cool punk tone when compressed and eq'ed, plus rerecording bass wasn't an option
. Drums were fairly simple as the samples I used got me really close to the sound I was looking for, The kick received some saturation from a console emulation and a little eq and compression from waves r eq and 1176 emulation. I blended in some of the original recorded snare top mic to add a bit of body to my sample and to help it fit with the overheads followed by some minor eq compression and a high frequency exciter.the close room mics were smashed by a blue stripe 1176 emulation and clipped using GVST's GClip plugin for some more crunch. The synth was run through Waves Doubler plugin to make it wide and to get it out of the way of the guitars. The clean intro guitar was ran through a Leslie Emulation for a cool effect and the main rhythm guitars received some minor eq and compression. In the choruses the lead vocal and it's double track were hard panned left and right and overall the vocals had some usual processing. The whole mix was compressed a touch (1 dB at most) by an emulation of an API 2500 Compressor. The snare, toms, guitars, and vocals got hit with some reverb. I have included both a Loud master and a master that conforms to the K14 mastering standard, both still retain dynamics but the hard master is just hotter overall. Please leave your comments and critiques and Enjoy.
Update: Thanks for the suggestions from TChianit. I added more of the sansamp bass to the mix and less of the di bass which gave me more edge in the lows. I also muted the drum close mics druing the final prechorus and just used the smashed room mics for the drums in that part to really contrast the song.
Hi DCP,
Thanks for all your cool comments and help on my mix 2 version.
First thing I have to say is I really liked your vocal sound for every place except the screaming at the end. The mix over all is really good and reminded me that there are times when you have to actually produce a mix and not justtweak knobs. Your mix gave me some ideas. But first,on the bass, I would've liked to hear it up a bit more and more of the amped part out in front. The samples you used are tasty but I would like to hear them blended more with the original kit, as they are now they seem just a tad too nice for this track. I liked the sub drops you did. The biggest difference I would like to see is at the sreaming vocal part. This mix has a nice vibe and energy going for it, but, at that part the energy drops too much. At that last pre I thought it might be cooler to change-up the drum sound making it a lot more edgy maybe use an overdone gated verb wtih some trash tnrown in to match the vocal but still keep the energy going. IDK that might be too much but it would be different. Also cut back and shorten the verb on the vox there. But again your vocal sound throughout the rest of the song is the best I've heard so far.
It may be just me but I'd swear the hard master has just a tadd less bottom and depth than the standard master. I mean it's a very subtle difference but I feel/hear it. Anyway, I like your effort much more than either of my tries.
TC
(31-10-2015, 01:08 AM)TChianit Wrote: [ -> ]Hi DCP,
Thanks for all your cool comments and help on my mix 2 version.
First thing I have to say is I really liked your vocal sound for every place except the screaming at the end. The mix over all is really good and reminded me that there are times when you have to actually produce a mix and not justtweak knobs. Your mix gave me some ideas. But first,on the bass, I would've liked to hear it up a bit more and more of the amped part out in front. The samples you used are tasty but I would like to hear them blended more with the original kit, as they are now they seem just a tad too nice for this track. I liked the sub drops you did. The biggest difference I would like to see is at the sreaming vocal part. This mix has a nice vibe and energy going for it, but, at that part the energy drops too much. At that last pre I thought it might be cooler to change-up the drum sound making it a lot more edgy maybe use an overdone gated verb wtih some trash tnrown in to match the vocal but still keep the energy going. IDK that might be too much but it would be different. Also cut back and shorten the verb on the vox there. But again your vocal sound throughout the rest of the song is the best I've heard so far.
It may be just me but I'd swear the hard master has just a tadd less bottom and depth than the standard master. I mean it's a very subtle difference but I feel/hear it. Anyway, I like your effort much more than either of my tries.
TC
Thanks TC for the reply, I tried a copy of my mix with your suggestions and ended up liking the results. I posted the new mix in my initial thread in the same Hard (K12) and Soft (K14) master format as last time, The limiter was the culprit for the loss of low end in the hard master so I just boosted the lows within Waves L3 LL to compensate.
Thanks TC for the reply, I tried a copy of my mix with your suggestions and ended up liking the results. I posted the new mix in my initial thread in the same Hard (K12) and Soft (K14) master format as last time, The limiter was the culprit for the loss of low end in the hard master so I just boosted the lows within Waves L3 LL to compensate.
[/quote]
Wow, and gee.
Thanks for taking the time to try my comments. The hard master is now my favorite and I forgot to mention this before but it's a lot more apprarent with the new mixes, the stereo spread and balance on the drum kit is just perfect I think and the gutars are really sweet too. I really like the last pre now. I just hope it's not too much a change for others. Not many people take what I say to heart as you have. Thanks again for the respect, much appreciated.
The new mixes really stand out as different paths now. But the hard master just punches you right in the face,
Hopefully when I get the time and rework my mix back more towards the original as you suggested it will sound half as good as this, maybe I'll just sample your drums, Hahahaha.
Really great work!
TC
(01-11-2015, 05:11 AM)TChianit Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks TC for the reply, I tried a copy of my mix with your suggestions and ended up liking the results. I posted the new mix in my initial thread in the same Hard (K12) and Soft (K14) master format as last time, The limiter was the culprit for the loss of low end in the hard master so I just boosted the lows within Waves L3 LL to compensate.
Wow, and gee.
Thanks for taking the time to try my comments. The hard master is now my favorite and I forgot to mention this before but it's a lot more apprarent with the new mixes, the stereo spread and balance on the drum kit is just perfect I think and the gutars are really sweet too. I really like the last pre now. I just hope it's not too much a change for others. Not many people take what I say to heart as you have. Thanks again for the respect, much appreciated.
The new mixes really stand out as different paths now. But the hard master just punches you right in the face,
Hopefully when I get the time and rework my mix back more towards the original as you suggested it will sound half as good as this, maybe I'll just sample your drums, Hahahaha.
Really great work!
TC
[/quote]
Haha, you're making me blush TC. In all seriousness though I always try to be as objective about my mixes as possible and take them from the perspective of the person on the otherside of the console, after all its pointless to only have a mix sound good on your system and sound like crap in the real world, that's the beauty of this forum. The fact that my set up consists of an mbox mini and a pair of AKG K240 headphones makes it that much more important for me to try other people's advice, there is no point in crediting or discrediting any tips or tricks without trying them out. I'm shure that you will find the right sound for your version of the track, keep going and and it will come to you.
A new mix and Master of this track I've been working on, what do you guys think?
Update: Made a new master as the last one had a really boomy low end, I used maxx bass to see what it would sound like on a master and it didn't work that well.
A little more compression was added as well.
Hey.
Nice mix! Nice music you got here. I really like effect on guitar you did. Balance also feel good. One thing i noticed at the first that there is to much low end on kick drum, but this could be a matter of taste. Im amateur so you know, i may not know what im talking about
Very inventive last part.
(01-04-2016, 12:38 PM)Lethan Wrote: [ -> ]Hey.
Nice mix! Nice music you got here. I really like effect on guitar you did. Balance also feel good. One thing i noticed at the first that there is to much low end on kick drum, but this could be a matter of taste. Im amateur so you know, i may not know what im talking about Very inventive last part.
Thanks for the reply! If you're talking about the remaster that excessive low end was probably the instance of Waves Maxx Bass I used when mastering, I was trying it out as a mastering too and ended up not liking it. I have a new master in that thread now with some more compression and no Maxx Bass.
I'll have a listen to your mix and leave my comments on it soon.
Hi DCP, sounding good! Some cool, creative things you've done in your mix...
I had a listen to your last 2 mixes (Remaster 1 & 2), and I noticed you mentioned using Maxxbass. As you already noted, Remaster 1 was very overpowering in the bass, and Remaster 2 is greatly improved...
However, I still think you could improve it further, as the bass still has a slight feeling of heaviness in the 40-80hz region that gives a kind of "stodgy" feeling to the groove of the song. I think the issue may be that the kick drum also has it's low end in that area, and it's creating a buildup, so the low end of the mix doesn't have the nice, fast bounce that is more flattering to this genre. Pulling out some of that area in the bass would allow the kick drum to cut through better, without creating a buildup. Still, on it's own, doing that might make the mix appear to be "bass-lite", so there is another strategy that might work to fill out the low end, while still keeping the "bounce"...
What I'm also noticing is that the low mids tend to be fairly scrupulously pulled out in the 150 - 250 hz region. While this leaves a nice gap for the low end of the snare, I think this is where you might be able bring up the apparent level of the bass. Maxxbass is actually really good for this task - you can set it to generate more harmonics in that low-mid region of the mix. This not only makes the bass appear louder, but it also enhances how full the bass sounds on small, relatively lo-fi playback systems.
That said, that lo-mid area of the mix is notorious for creating a muddy sounding mix if you overdo it, but it's worth exploring how much you can get away with before that happens.