04-12-2014, 12:10 AM
Hey Stu, I'm glad I'm able to help you a bit... almost everything I know about mixing I learned from this forum.... it's the least I could do.
Regarding compression, I've learned that compressing a mix in stages much as you've described is often the key to a good balance.... and you can never have too many compressors to choose from, even if you mostly only use a couple. Quick tip: not sure how much you like to use tools like these, but I've found it useful in some situation to consider saturation and distortion as very colorful forms of compression, as they decrease the dynamic range as they color the signal, but without the "squeeze." So sometimes, when a channel needs a bit of flare, you can ultimately get compression and color at the same time.... and if you do it in parallel, you can EQ the distorted signal and get the color/compression only where you want it!
Regarding M/S eq, cutting the bass in the sides channel is the best use I've ever found for it. Basically, all bass frequencies are non-directional in the real world because the waves are too large for our ears to discern where they came from, so having bass in the sides channel really doesn't accomplish anything other than eating up headroom and pissing off your buss compressor. Be careful about EQing the mids channel, though... that can ruin a decent mix really quickly... tends to sound really weird IMHO, and you might be better off using a normal stereo compressor in most cases.
Another cool M/S EQ trick for quieter genres is a small high shelving dip in the treble range on the sides channel. Think about it in terms of the depth field: the instruments furthest to the side of your mix will generally be what you want sounding furthest away from the listener, and high cuts are a great way to create that illusion. The cool thing about EQing the sides channel is that the further you pan a channel from the center, the more it will be affected by the EQ... so rack toms panned 20% from the center won't be distanced by very much, but tambourines and shakers panned hard left and right will be pushed further back uniformly... just remember that subtlety is the key with any sort of M/S processing.
So gating... why do you have a tough time with them? In fast paced rock it's necessary almost 100% of the time to trim the note tails off of the toms, especially the floor toms, if you want to keep it loud and rocking with a clear low end. Gating is honestly the easiest way to do it if there are tons of fast fills like this, but if you prefer to do it manually that'd work just as well. Expanders will work and might be a bit easier to keep natural sounding, but if you're like me and you like to compress the drum buss, that compression will most likely fight the expanders, so IMHO a gate is a better option.... but they take a bit of practice and I honestly prefer editing to gates in most other situations.
Anyway, I'm no expert and certainly not a pro, but you clearly are eager to learn, so let me know if you'd ever like another detailed review and I'll be happy to oblige with what little I know. Such a big topic, mixing is, and I seem to learn something new every time I load up a new track. Keep it up, dude.
Regarding compression, I've learned that compressing a mix in stages much as you've described is often the key to a good balance.... and you can never have too many compressors to choose from, even if you mostly only use a couple. Quick tip: not sure how much you like to use tools like these, but I've found it useful in some situation to consider saturation and distortion as very colorful forms of compression, as they decrease the dynamic range as they color the signal, but without the "squeeze." So sometimes, when a channel needs a bit of flare, you can ultimately get compression and color at the same time.... and if you do it in parallel, you can EQ the distorted signal and get the color/compression only where you want it!
Regarding M/S eq, cutting the bass in the sides channel is the best use I've ever found for it. Basically, all bass frequencies are non-directional in the real world because the waves are too large for our ears to discern where they came from, so having bass in the sides channel really doesn't accomplish anything other than eating up headroom and pissing off your buss compressor. Be careful about EQing the mids channel, though... that can ruin a decent mix really quickly... tends to sound really weird IMHO, and you might be better off using a normal stereo compressor in most cases.
Another cool M/S EQ trick for quieter genres is a small high shelving dip in the treble range on the sides channel. Think about it in terms of the depth field: the instruments furthest to the side of your mix will generally be what you want sounding furthest away from the listener, and high cuts are a great way to create that illusion. The cool thing about EQing the sides channel is that the further you pan a channel from the center, the more it will be affected by the EQ... so rack toms panned 20% from the center won't be distanced by very much, but tambourines and shakers panned hard left and right will be pushed further back uniformly... just remember that subtlety is the key with any sort of M/S processing.
So gating... why do you have a tough time with them? In fast paced rock it's necessary almost 100% of the time to trim the note tails off of the toms, especially the floor toms, if you want to keep it loud and rocking with a clear low end. Gating is honestly the easiest way to do it if there are tons of fast fills like this, but if you prefer to do it manually that'd work just as well. Expanders will work and might be a bit easier to keep natural sounding, but if you're like me and you like to compress the drum buss, that compression will most likely fight the expanders, so IMHO a gate is a better option.... but they take a bit of practice and I honestly prefer editing to gates in most other situations.
Anyway, I'm no expert and certainly not a pro, but you clearly are eager to learn, so let me know if you'd ever like another detailed review and I'll be happy to oblige with what little I know. Such a big topic, mixing is, and I seem to learn something new every time I load up a new track. Keep it up, dude.
(03-12-2014, 06:40 AM)manuke Wrote: pauli, hey thanks so much for taking all that time to leave such detailed feedack, really appreciate it and given me plenty to think about, awesome. Especially pleased re the compression comment, no way do I normally crush stuff to that extent [and you're right, not too much on the buss but lots on every track bar the rhythm gtrs]. I actually use m/s eq all the time but mainly to clear out the middle, never really considered what you suggested re the sides. Brilliant, definitely gonna start experimenting with that one. And def gonna take the rest of your advice on board, [though me and gates don't get along too well]. Again, thanks mate. Stu.
I'm grateful for comments and suggestions. Thank you for listening!